No, what benefit you will derive there? Your problem is that if at the time of death you can remember Krishna, then it is success. We are not going to any other planet.
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[Posted February 21, 2007]

Wasting Time

His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

Founder-Acharya of the world-wide Hare Krishna Movement, Brahma Sampradaya Acharya

Srila Prabhupada

morning walk with disciples, Honolulu, June 10, 1975  


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so you like to gaze at the moon?Planetary situation according to the Bhagavata

Harikesa: Srila Prabhupada, I was wondering if it was more important to understand the universal make up or simply to accept what Srimad-Bhagavatam says.

Prabhupada: That means you don't accept Srimad-Bhagavatam?

Harikesa: No. But some of the things in Srimad-Bhagavatam are difficult to understand.

Prabhupada: Rascal, fool. Therefore it is difficult for you.

Harikesa: Yes.

Prabhupada: You should not... You understand or not understand, you have to accept it.

Harikesa: That is why we are asking so many questions about the moon and the planets.

Prabhupada: Yes, so where is the doubt? It is a fact that they did not go to the moon. That's a fact.

Harikesa: I'm just trying to understand for preaching purposes.

Prabhupada: Why do you try to understand?

Harikesa: Because I have a hard time explaining about the make up of the universe as far as...

Prabhupada: That make up is all right, what they say?

Harikesa: What they say?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Harikesa: No.

Prabhupada: Then don't understand them also, you don't understand here also. Then what you will do?

Siddha-svarupa: What it is is that we're automatically taking as authoritative what the scientists say, but we don't think is authoritative what Srila Prabhupada and the Bhagavata is saying.

Harikesa: Well, the difficulty I was having about this mountain, this Meru. It sounds... It's very difficult to explain that to someone.

Prabhupada: No, no, that is difficult, but everything is difficult for you. Because you want to see. You have not seen their arrangement; neither you have seen our arrangement. So but your proposition is you don't believe what you don't see. You have not seen neither of them, so you have to remain silent.

Harikesa: So the best position is just remain silent until realization comes?

Prabhupada: No. You should... Shukadeva Gosvami says. You have to believe that. It is an idea. If you believe or not believe, it doesn't matter. But you can get an idea about the planetary situation. That's all. Neither you can go there; neither you can see it. An idea is given, that is all. But there is no argument.

Harikesa: No.

Prabhupada: No.


"Thief, thief, cousin brother"

Siddha-svarupa: Did the people who said they went to the moon, did they go to another planet?

Prabhupada: Yes. Or they did not go anywhere. They were in the desert... What is that?

Devotees: Arizona.

Prabhupada: Arizona. That's all. That is possible.

Siddha-svarupa: Yes, it's possible. I wouldn't put anything beyond them.

Prabhupada: They are all doing this nonsense here on this planet and showing and advertising that.

Siddha-svarupa: Yes, they made big propaganda that they would get there, and then they had to succeed. And then they showed that they succeeded, they stopped the program.

Prabhupada: That one film?

Srutakirti: Oh, King Kong. [laughter]

Prabhupada: King Kong. It was made in laboratory.

Bali-mardan: Yes.

Harikesa: Also 2001 was very expertly made like that. There is one movie, 2001, which looked even better than the moon shots.

Devotee: Someone was arguing with me that if, like Russia and America both are enemies, if Russia achieves something great like going to the moon, America will immediately try to expose it. But on the contrary, America accepted all those things. And because...

Prabhupada: Then there is also... Both of them are thieves, they have made agreement, "Don't expose me. I'll not expose you."

Devotee: So that is their agree... But they are enemies...

Prabhupada: No, no, enemies, they are not enemies. They are simply rogues and thieves, that's all.

Paramahamsa: Because if they tried to expose Russia, they would also expose themselves.

Siddha-svarupa: It's like these so many gurus. They're not actually enemies. They're actually individually working to exploit the people. And if they get in each other's way, if one person tries to take the other person's followers, then there's some clash or something. But as long they can leave each other alone and don't fight and work independently, exploiting, then they live peacefully.

Bali-mardan: Honor among thieves.

Prabhupada: "Thief, thief, cousin brother." Chora chora, pasura bhai. So far our position is that we are not concerned with anything with this universe. We are concerned with Krishnaloka. So whatever one may say, one other may say, we don't care for that. We are not going to the moon planet, Jupiter planet.


What is the benefit to human society?

Siddha-svarupa: There's a danger that we become overly concerned with debating on them.

Harikesa: So our preaching platform should be is that "You don't know." We can say, "You don't know" or "We don't know. Why shouldn't one accept what we say over what you say?" We should just prove that we...

Prabhupada: No, accept or not accept, the whatever is description there, in Bhagavatam, we are accepted.

Harikesa: So we should not try to meet these scientists on any scientific platform? Rather, on...

Siddha-svarupa: Why not on the platform of not being the body? Why should you...

Prabhupada: Yes.

Siddha-svarupa: Why not speak on what we're trying to speak about instead of overly indulge in that which is beyond debate actually?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Siddha-svarupa: Ask them, "Are you the body?" If they say, "Yes," and then ask them to show how...

Prabhupada: Just like here in America I have come to preach Krishna consciousness. I am not interested for sight-seeing. That is not my business. Whatever you say, "It is here like this," "All right, That's all, finished." Why should we try to confirm it? Whatever you say, that's all right. Now, we are seeing the other part; if somebody there, "It is like this," that's all right. I'm not going to test it. So what is the use of arguing? I have no interest.

Siddha-svarupa: The materialists, they want to argue on the platform of material arrangements, and there's...

Prabhupada: That is useless.

Siddha-svarupa: Yes.

Prabhupada: What he will gain by such argument? You are not going there neither you are interested for going to the moon planet. For knowledge sake it is stated in the Srimad-Bhagavatam, and everyone is... Just like when we speak of the hell, everyone is little anxious, "Where are the hell?" So that is described. In the down this universe there are lokas.

Harikesa: So, in other words, it would make no... It would be not a very good program to get some understanding from Vedic astronomy, like, say, some expert Vedic astronomers.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Harikesa: It would not be a good program...?

Prabhupada: No, what benefit you will derive there? Your problem is that if at the time of death you can remember Krishna, then it is success. We are not going to any other planet. Yanti deva-vrata devan [Bhagavad-gita 9.25], let them go. We are not interested in these things.

Siddha-svarupa: There's only a certain amount of time and a certain amount of..., that we can talk about to people. And if we're talking about so many material arrangements, then it means that we can't be talking about that which is actually important. So we have to make a choice, whether we're going to get straight to the point or beat around the bush. [break]

Prabhupada: ...no interest in a particular subject, why should you bother your head about it?

Harikesa: I become very fascinated when I read these descriptions in Srimad-Bhagavatam about the creation and the universal...

Prabhupada: Yes, yes. That's gist idea of the universal position. That is sufficient.

Harikesa: So, in other words, Shukadeva Gosvami is always bringing Maharaja Parikshit to the platform of "Why bother with all of this? Simply perform devotional service"?

Prabhupada: Huh? No, no. He's giving full knowledge of the universal affairs. He also says at the end that "I have described whatever I have heard." That's all.

Harikesa: So we should simply describe it without being concerned that the scientific mind may make sense out of it or not?

Prabhupada: What is this nonsense scientific? That is... We reject immediately. What is scientific? A tiny brain, what is their science? Phene bare dhake nate ute. A snake catcher... There is a kind of snake which has no poison. So he cannot catch even that non-poisonous snake, and he's trying to catch one cobra. So these scientists, what is their value? What they have done anything contribution to the world for the benefit of the human society? They could not give any relief from the disease, relief from old age, relief from death or birth. These are the real problems. So what is their contribution? They have given some horseless carriage. Again there is problem of power. What is actually benefit they have done, that this is the benefit from the scientists? Anything they have done, there is counter disadvantage. This is simply waste of time. Our... We consider our human life is very valuable, and before the next death we should prepare ourself go back to home, back to Godhead. This is our philosophy. We cannot waste a minute time before the next death comes. That is our philosophy. So why should we waste our time, "Where is the moon? Where is sun?" Just have it gist idea, that's all. [break] ...no profit. Suppose the position of the moon is correct according to Bhagavata or according to the scientist, what benefit we shall get out of it? Whichever may be correct or wrong.

Siddha-svarupa: Yes, right.

Prabhupada: We are not getting any profit out of it. So why should we bother about it? Adhara vapare jaj akalara. We are dealing in ginger. Then what is the use of asking, "What is the hire, I mean to say, freight for a big ship?" If you are dealing with ginger, ginger is not sold by tons. When you go to purchase ginger, you take one or two pieces. So those who are dealing in ginger, what is the use of asking what is the fare of a freight ship? We are not going to...

Siddha-svarupa: It doesn't have anything to do... [break]

Prabhupada: ...be done by Darwin, that he will live for fifty years; he is giving account millions of years. "Some millions of years after, this evolution takes place like this." Huh? Will he live for millions of years? Why he's talking of millions of years? This is a waste of time. He will live for fifty years or, say, utmost, hundred years, and he's talking of millions of years.

Srutakirti: Just like that man who wrote the letter yesterday. He's prepared to spend the rest of his life understanding the transfer, the transmigration of the soul instead of just accepting it in the Gita. He's going to spend his whole life.

Prabhupada: No, no. His non-acceptance means he's a rascal. He's a rascal. He may waste his time in that way. What can be done? His non-acceptance means he's a rascal. It's evident. Anyone knows that "After this, I will get another body." You are all young men. You know that you will get after some years a body like me. So what is the difficulty to understand that we are changing body?


Material proof does not compel spiritual surrender

Paramahamsa: So actually it's useless to try to give any more proof other than that.

Prabhupada: That is sufficient for an intelligent man. That is sufficient.

Paramahamsa: So if a scientist or someone who has some degree in science comes to our movement, should we encourage him to try to prove through science the Krishna conscious principle of transmigration and eternal quality of the soul?

Prabhupada: Not necessary. Not necessary.

Paramahamsa: Better if he just...

Prabhupada: It is not that if we prove scientifically there is soul, if there is scientific proof, not that all the people of the world will become Krishna conscious, even if you do that. So it is useless. You simply understand what is stated by Krishna.

Harikesa: Can a material calculation prove a spiritual fact?

Prabhupada: Huh?

Harikesa: Can a material calculation prove...

Prabhupada: No. Materialists cannot understand spiritual subject matter. It is not for them.


Wasting Time/ WORLD SANKIRTAN PARTY
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